How Would Our Law Makers Respond to a Terror Attack with Guns?

Last year a leaked executive memo from the New Zealand Defence Force warned that a terror attack on home soil is “Not a matter of if, but when”. 

The “Personal Security – Keeping You Safe” message written by the Chief Security Officer said NZDF staff were especially vulnerable to terrorist groups who could strike anytime. 

“The worst thing you and I can do from now on is assume that it won’t happen to me. This normalcy bias is no longer appropriate when the definition of normal has changed for good and a false sense of security could in fact be deadly.”

The Threat

Jeffrey Sluka is a Massey University academic who specialises in political terrorism. He has also acknowledged to the media that there are young men living in New Zealand who had been indoctrinated by Isis.

Here are some recent incidents highlighting the problem:

  • Passports have been seized from people planning to travel to Syria to fight.
  • Up to 40 individuals are being actively monitored as terror threats.
  • Recently, Imran Patel, a 26-year-old from Auckland, was jailed for three years after pleading guilty to possessing, making and distributing extremist video footage of people being beheaded and burned alive.
  • In a separate incident, an Isis sympathiser, Niroshan Nawarajan, was sentenced to five months on home detention for possessing extremist publications. The 27-year-old was arrested after walking into the United States consulate in Auckland and asking if the building was “bomb-proof”.
  • 12 New Zealand women who have gone to Islamic State-controlled areas in Syria and Iraq in the last 12 months to become jihadi brides.

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Islamic terrorists have struck at innocents all around the world with such regularity that many simply consider their horrors the ‘New reality’. They have used planes and bombs and trucks and knives and guns.

But what would be the government’s response to a terror event here with guns?

The Police Association are pushing for bans, so are the Greens and Labour and they only need apathy from shooters or an outcry from the public to achieve their goals.

The bottom line is that an act of terror in New Zealand could lead to rapid changes in firearm legislation. So we can NOT allow political correctness to threaten either our people or our rights. If there is an issue here then it must be looked in the eye.

If anything reasonable can be done to prevent such an atrocity here – that action must be taken.

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Is the SIS Watching Terrorists Arm Up?

The Kiwi Gun Blog has made an Official Information Act request to the SIS and the Minister responsible for the service, Chris Finlayson. We asked if anyone with a New Zealand firearms license has been investigated for links to terrorism in New Zealand.

Further, if there was any evidence of a person of concern applying for a gun license.

We were all horrified to learn that thirty known gang members had gun licenses in New Zealand. With apparent inaction from the Police.

Could this also be the case with terror suspects?

The SIS refused to answer the question.

They claimed that saying if anyone on the counter terrorism risk register had applied for a gun license would ‘Prejudice security’. Even without naming anyone.

So they could be watching people arm up – legally – for the incident that could kill kiwis and lead to near instant gun bans.

We need an official policy that any links to terror groups disqualifies a person as being ‘Fit and proper’ to possess a New Zealand gun license. 

Yes – such a policy may be open to abuse. But we would rather that an innocent person had to go to court on appeal than kiwis die.

The Blog also asked the Minister of Justice, Amy Adams, if it was a special offense to supply a firearm to a terrorist organisation or for a terrorist act. Or if this was just treated as providing a gun to someone without a license.

She has yet to reply.

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“The SIS is warning that the 40 people on a terror watch-list in New Zealand have become more determined and capable since recent European attacks”.

The Elephant in the Room

There are around fifty thousand Muslims in New Zealand and growing.

Islamic extremism kills 500 humans a month but the left are correct when they point out that only a tiny number of Muslims will murder in the name of their faith. One in a thousand they say. Judging by the number in New Zealand and the number on the watch-list – that looks about right.

What if ONE of them slips through the net and acts with a gun?

The blog does not want to appear insensitive here but the facts are in. Illegal guns were found hidden in Mosques in Germany, Greece, France, London and elsewhere. These communities also enabled attacks and assisted the perpetrators after the act.

There IS an issue here. The threat has come to New Zealand and it needs to be discussed.

The single person blocked from the Kiwi Gun Blog’s Facebook page could not even accept our questioning Muslim women being able to wear a veil for their gun license image. The  strange man went as far as registering fake profiles to keep trolling us on the subject.

This needs to be discussed openly and without intimidation from SJW bullies.

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Professor Greg Barton of Deakin University, one of Australia’s leading scholars on terrorism and violent extremism, said it was inevitable that Islamic State recruitment would reach New Zealand.

The organisation was spreading rapidly throughout the world through social networks and was causing serious problems in Australia.

He told the media that: Radical Islam will come to New Zealand “soon enough” and New Zealand should prepare for its arrival.

The Police Association Are Expecting a ‘Religious Attack’

The Police Association raised the matter only a few months ago when speaking to Newstalk ZB. Then Police Association president Greg O’Connor and law professor Al Gillespie were doing the media rounds about urging a certain Parliamentary select committee to launch a register for firearms.

“Mr O’Connor told Larry Williams New Zealand shouldn’t have to wait until it faces a right-wing or religious shooting, to change the law”.

They claimed that such a register “…would prevent the illegal possession and trade of firearms, and stockpiling of military assault-grade weapons”.

So the deceitful Police Union is already raising the issue of terrorism as another reason to punish the lawful. While the nation continues to admit high risk migrants.

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A Recent Case

Just over a year ago the media publicized the Facebook page of an Auckland man. The images there showed him posing with an Islamic State flag – while holding an AK47-style rifle. He spoke of his role in a holy war.

At this time the Police refused to comment. Saying that Harun Abdul-Majeed SaifuAllah’s profile was a “security matter”. The Facebook page was soon disabled. But such attitudes remain.

Mr SaifuAllah, then 23, told the Herald that he “100 per cent” supported the views and actions of Islamic State. Oh he changed his name a few years before from William Ringo Ratapu-Howard.

Mr SaifuAllah said he converted to Islam at this time to escape his life of drugs and crime. “I was in Black Power. I couldn’t see my life going anywhere, I was having a bad life, I was a gang member.”

It is very common around the world for Islam to recruit from the prison population.

He said the Government had confiscated his passport, stopping him travelling to Sydney  where he planned to marry his Lebanese fiancée. He had been repeatedly questioned by the SIS about his beliefs.

“I stand by my views 100 per cent.”

Herald: Mr SaifuAllah who has also used the surname Curtis and says he is actor Cliff Curtis’ nephew, said there is a network of other young men in New Zealand who hold the same beliefs as him.

Mr SaifuAllah has multiple photos and comments on his Facebook page professing allegiance to the terrorist group.

His photos are captioned with war cries and comments made this week spoke of his role in a holy war fought so “one day Islam will dominate everything that the sun sets on”.

He has images of the Islamic State flag and other propaganda from the terrorist group.

The Kiwi Gun Blog has asked the Police Minister:

1. What charges he faced for threatening with the firearm.

2. If the gun was legally owned – was he stripped of his license?

3 If the gun was not legally owned – did he face charges of unlawful possession?

4. Where is the weapon now?

This assumes that the weapon was real and not a replica. The man claimed to look forward to a confrontation with authorities so it would seem so.

 

So what can we do?

Push for zero tolerance for any person of interest known to have guns.

The Kiwi Gun Blog is about protecting the rights of shooters, not attacking them. But if you have connections to terror groups then you are no longer a ‘Fit and proper person’. If the SIS or the Police get it wrong – go to court.

We take guns off those involved in alleged domestic disturbances, surely we can extend that to terror suspects as a matter of course?

It would also be interesting to know how many of those on the terror watch list were born here. If the threats are presenting from the same areas – this needs to be addressed. Honestly.

The Hegelian Dialectic

This is an interpretive method in which the contradiction between a proposition (thesis) and its antithesis is resolved at a higher level of truth (synthesis).

But it is also a system used to manipulate the public. A government will either create or simply allow a situation to develop through inaction. That will then have a consequence and result in the need to act in response.

The ‘Solution’ is then offered. This was in fact the original goal of the proceedings. But what the public would never have accepted before – they now ask for. Or accept the need for.

Just thought that we would mention that…..

No reason.

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Please be respectful in the comments.

 

12 responses to “How Would Our Law Makers Respond to a Terror Attack with Guns?”

  1. Our system is based upon the detection and prosecution of those who have or are proved to have conspired to break our laws – not upon pre-emption or prosecution “just in case”.

    Upon the dictum that it is better that 1,000 guilty go free rather than one innocent suffer unwarranted prosecution.

    Crimes – even terrorist attacks – CANNOT be ‘prevented’ by prosecuting or hounding the innocent.

    Your comment: “But we would rather that an innocent person had to go to court on appeal than kiwis die.” is in fact abhorrent and it is our authorities primary purpose to ensure that this does NOT happen.

    Perhaps this attitude is prompted by the official denial of our right to self protection? For the final effect of such an attitude is that ALL items capable of being used for any Attacks be removed from society – including firearms, vehicles, sharp and blunt instruments – even hands and feet!

    NOTHING but good intelligence and pre-kowledge of any attack can have any effect upon that attack – Not even TOTAL surveillance – TOTAL disarmament – TOTAL repression.

    The price of a free society is that some few indeed do become the victims of predators – and the provision of the right of arming for self defence.

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    1. In an ideal world, where our rights are recognized and enshrined in law, we would agree with you. But in NZ we are at perpetual risk. A modest compromise would be to treat terror suspects as we (Theoretically) do gang association. No longer ‘fit and proper’ to own a gun. Thank you for your thoughtful responses.

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      1. Once ‘modest compromise’ becomes part of the thought process the slippery slope is simply greased.

        A litany of modest compromises ends up with one big loss of liberty.

        Any compromise simply leads to more and more incremental steps towards death by a thousand cuts.

        Unless the firearms community begins to understand that they must say “NO” and mean it there will be a continual erosion till NOTHING is left.

        BTW – when do we add Jews to the list?

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  2. Your comment: “But we would rather that an innocent person had to go to court on appeal than kiwis die.” is in fact abhorrent and it is our authorities primary purpose to ensure that this does NOT happen. I have to agree with you Doug. There is no need for knee-jerk reactions but that is what will happen in the wake of a terrorist event here in NZ. The authorities would have to be seen to be doing something and NZ Licensed Firearms Owners WILL BE their first port of call.

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  3. Kev F – I understand that which is why Firearms Owners have to make very clear that ill-directed and unprincipled attacks upon Licenced Firearms Owners will result in severe POLITICAL backlashes … and ongoing backlashes at the ballot box.

    “Doing Something” (by attacking the innocent) must be replaced by actually combating Terrrorism and Crime.

    Until THAT is drilled in to the Political mind our liberties are endangered.

    Further restrictions and wholesale changes to society simply means that terrorists and criminals drive society and any reaction is dependent upon the lawless not upon the type of free society we wish to live in.

    Neither terrorism nor crime can be combated by the ‘authorities’ alone – especially when the armed members of society are no longer involved – or worse still no longer in support of them.

    That is the harsh truth of the matter which has to be understood. If (and WHEN) the ‘authorities are overwhelmed then any support available becomes crucial for protection of the entire Realm.

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  4. you’re going too far here Kiwigunblog. Just stick to attacking the select committee report otherwise you’ll end up being another right wing blog and lose wider support.

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    1. Right. So the Police are saying we should expect a ‘Religious attack’ – with a gun. The army are saying that its ‘When not If’. Experts who study the issue say NZ is at risk. The SIS are monitoring 40 high risk subjects. We provided numerous examples of extremists in New Zealand who have been convicted by the courts. But the Blog suggesting that a policy of not letting terror suspects have guns is ‘Too far’? Yeah… nah.

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      1. Ah! … but how do we prevent them having TRUCKS?

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  5. do you think that they’d even bother getting a gun liscence. The attacks in Europe, were all done by unliscenced people and unliscenced guns.

    Also be careful what you wish for as the first people the cops are going to accuse of being potential hazards and revoke liscences are people who run this blog being ” subversive elements and instigators of disorder”

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    1. Firstly you are correct. Terrorists use illegal machine guns in nations where the citizens are no longer allowed basic rights as shooters. Again, we are also aware that this is a slippery slope. But would you want someone with gang connections – provable in a court – to have a gun license? For the 40 people on the watchlist – we believe that the same prohibition should apply. An uncomfortable compromises to help prevent losing gun ownership all together.

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  6. What ever Governments are asked to do to others they will eventually do to ALL.

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